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 The WIP "Whizz-verse"

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captainwhizz

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PostSubject: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Fri Oct 10, 2014 3:31 am

OK people, I will try to keep it short and snappy where possible so it's not too much of a chore to read through.

So, my plan has moved away from my original idea of a re-written Marvel universe, but I'm still incorporating elements from that, so if I refer to Marvel stuff it's just so you know what my starting point is.

My intention is to write fiction for POD, maybe a comic or two if I can persuade some artists, but also to write a lot of in-universe reference material, like the Marvel Civil War Companion and Atlas, etc. My original plan was to present it as being Nick Fury's ultra-classified SHIELD files, so I need a Fury and I need a SHIELD.

I'm going to have characters age, retire, die, etc, and resurrection is pretty unlikely. I'm going to be setting out the history and the timeline, so I can jump backwards and forwards in the setting without messing stuff up too much, but get a variety of stories in.

In some ways, it will be like the Wold Newton Universe, except instead of trying to make stuff fit with the original sources, I'm going to take the characters, elements, etc from the original stories, take the stuff I like, and leave out the stuff I don't.

I'm going to incorporate all the crazy gods, titans, etc as much as possible. Angels will probably be in there on a similar power level to the gods (although, obviously, some are more powerful than others, I might have to draw up a tier system).

Greco-Roman myths, Egyptian stuff, Norse legends, all that goodness, all happened for real in my universe. Places like Asgard and Olympus are within the universe, but accessed from Earth by portals of some description. Deteriorated portals = gods going missing for a while.

Speaking of gods, we all know that, back in the day, they liked to put it about a bit with the mortals, right? Creating demi-gods like Hercules. Well, the blood of the gods may be diluted, but it still runs through some people today, and this explains how there are some guys and gals out there that seem to be able to do things that the average person just couldn't. Robin Hood, Sherlock Holmes, Tarzan, Einstein, Sinbad, Jimi Hendrix, Daredevil, whoever.

But there will also be crazy science and other reasons for superpowers too, it won't all be one source.

Nuclear power/ bombs mess with stuff (highly technical!) and start opening the portals to the other realms up again; they also might mess with people's god-blood genes (kind of like X-men, with a more magical explanation). So more heroes and weirder powers appear after WWII.

I'm not really fond of having super-duper powered characters running around, unless they have decent weaknesses. Guys like Silver-Age Superman, or even worse those with powers like the Sentry, don't really do it for me, a hero needs to overcome adversity, not use his "I can do anything" hand-wave and fix it all. However, characters that can chew through mooks and punch through walls, but can't just laugh off artillery shells, those I can get behind.

So I will have pulp/ GA adventures. Heroes on the front (and behind enemy lines) in Europe and the Pacific, heroes at home fighting criminals and spies, and sneaky spec-ops heroes.

Then, late '50s to early '60s probably, I will bring in my next wave, my sci-fi adventuring heroes, Fantastic Four stand-ins, and so on. So alien contact can begin, maybe the first moonbase (super-geniuses accelerate tech growth faster than the real world), establishing trade with Barsoom.

The cold war will have a superpower arms race, so in the US there would be Stark-equivalent making purely tech, whilst Oscorp-expy works on tech and experimenting on people (like the Ultimate Marvel direction). Which leads to cool new heroes and villains.

After that, I'm thinking it may get a little cyberpunk-y, corrupt politicians and corporations that need taking down, as well as terrorists etc.

But then don't forget about Dracula, what's he up to? Building a vampire army? What about these gods and demons that are returning? Frankenstein's monster, werewolves? Luckily, holy orders of knights dedicated to fighting the supernatural are still around, only nowadays they wear black suits and carry semi-automatic pistols.

What do you think?

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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Fri Oct 10, 2014 3:59 am

In terms of GA PD characters, I've got to have the Black Bat in, I see him like (Marvel's) Daredevil crossed with the Punisher.

The Clock- needs to be done.

Daredevil- just too awesome to leave out.

Ghost- he's my Moon Knight.

Black Terror- he's my Phantom, generations of the same family taking up the name.

Blue Beetle- because I remember reading my dad's stash of Silver-Age comics when I was younger, I want Dan Garret and Ted Kord, but with no scarab involvement.

Black Fury/ Kid Fury/ Miss Fury- probably my Bat-family. Or one of, anyway.

Arrow- my archer, vital for the connection with military intelligence.

Blue Fire- because I made a hero called the Blue Flame when I was a kid.

Amazing Man- because Iron Fist.

V-Man- Citizen V

Heap- Swamp Thing/ Man Thing

Cat-Man- another Batman?

Captain Red Cross- probably adapted to either Swiss or English patriotic hero

London- to give me some Blitz action

Silver Streak- gotta have a speedster

Fighting Yank/ The Shield/ American Crusader/ American Eagle (Nedor)/ others- who can I leave out? Why not take them all? It's a big war, after all.

Scarab- get some Egyptian mojo in there.

Grim Reaper- my Destroyer, to London's Union Jack perhaps?

Shark- the son of Neptune fits perfectly.

Human Torch, Defender and Sun Girl, just to give me a little Marvel feel, but probably unneeded.


That's just the heroes I've picked so far!


I was also debating having Captain Battle in, and having his son or Nathan Hale (probably Nathan) as my Nick Fury.


Last edited by captainwhizz on Fri Oct 10, 2014 7:12 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added Shark)
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Fri Oct 10, 2014 5:04 am

captainwhizz wrote:
I'm going to take the characters, elements, etc from the original stories, take the stuff I like, and leave out the stuff I don't.

What do you think?


Real world comics as they are now can be considered fiction in-universe, propaganda or misremembered adventures. That can be a story plot seed of some reporter trying to research fact from myth.
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captainwhizz

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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Fri Oct 10, 2014 7:15 am

Interesting, I'll keep that in mind, thanks Smile
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:54 am

I like what you've laid out, Cap. BTW, another character you might want to toss in is the movie serial version of Captain America. No shield, rides a motorcycle, uses a gun, and has black gloves & boots. Secret identity is DA Grant Gardner (or something like that), and he takes on mobsters as well as supervillains. Although the original serial was set in the 40s, I could easily see it taking place in the 50s or 60s, so maybe he's the matured son or sidekick of one of the WWII super-patriots? As for name, I figured the easiest thing to do would be call him "Mr. America."
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Sun Oct 12, 2014 9:33 pm

I did look at using him, I like the idea of making him a character that comes after the first wave.

Or, I could use him as a fictional character inside the universe?

Does anyone have any ideas for a good Nick Fury stand-in? Or shall I just create my own?
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Mon Oct 13, 2014 6:51 am

captainwhizz wrote:
I did look at using him, I like the idea of making him a character that comes after the first wave.
Or, I could use him as a fictional character inside the universe?
Either way might be interesting... It would be funny if Republic decided to make a serial about the real-life superhero the Shield, but it somehow wound up being the "Captain America" serial ... much to the amusement of both the Shield and his colleagues! I'm not sure what else you can do with the character other than as a background piece, but if you weren't going to do anything with him anyway, that background stuff could be fun.

captainwhizz wrote:
Does anyone have any ideas for a good Nick Fury stand-in? Or shall I just create my own?
The PDSH Wiki is a great resource, but I always check my personal files first. Looking at the characters I have categorized as "Agents/Spies," I came across many possibilities, but the one I think I like the best as a "Nick Fury" analog is Black Friday, from Holyoke, premiering in 1942. This is what my notes say: "Military Intelligence Officer Lee Ainsley is gunned down and reported dead. However, an unnamed doctor saves his life, fakes a death certificate, and gives him a new face. He's now a secret agent known as Black Friday, as he brings bad luck to the enemies of America." He could easily rise through the ranks and ultimately be tapped to run your version of SHIELD. If you wanted, you could even say that one of the side effects of the life-saving treatment was that (like Nick Fury) Black Friday is currently in much better shape and much more spry than a WWII vet has any right to be.

If he doesn't work for you, let me know and I'll post some others.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Tue Oct 14, 2014 6:28 am

"They made a serial about me! Wait, they changed my costume... they gave me a shield.... they called me Captain America!?!?!"

Black Friday looks perfect, thanks Smile PDSH says he works counter-espionage, and defends the country from saboteurs and super-villains, which would make him an ideal candidate to head a new defense/ security agency in a world of superhumans.

I think that The Arrow will probably be his successor, as straddling both the intelligence and superhero worlds would mean that, as he cut back on active crime-fighting, he could take a leadership position within the agency.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Tue Oct 14, 2014 8:23 am

Speaking of the serial CA, anyone know that he was actually referenced in Marvel 616?

Take the info (from Wiki) with a grain of salt. In Captain America V1 issue 219 (March 1978), it is revealed that a Captain America serial also exists within the Marvel Continuity. In this version, Captain America himself plays the role (in secret), taking the place of the stunt man who was shot during production due to the prop master being the Nazi spy Lyle Decker. Like the real-life serial, Cap's shield is replaced with a standard gun, his identity is changed, and his sidekick Bucky is absent.

http://readingcaptainamerica.blogspot.com/2010/08/captain-america-serial-captain-america.html

In 2007, after Marvel's Civil War event, Captain America (Steve Rogers) was seemingly killed off. News channel CNN produced a special on the death, showing the serial with Grant Gardner as Captain America while it was focusing on the death of Steve Rogers. In Issue 27[clarification needed] of Captain America, the movie poster is seen in The Captain America Museum. (I have the issue, I didn't remember this, but its been a while since I read it.)

Steve Rogers' ex-girlfriend in the Ultimate Marvel continuity is named after Gail Richards, Grant Gardner's secretary.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Wed Oct 15, 2014 12:27 am

Thanks for the link, SHF; I'd heard that Marvel mentioned the serial in the comic, but never actually saw it...

Glad you like Black Friday, Whizz. And having the Arrow as his successor makes sense. One other thing you might want to consider is a "James Bond" agent for your version of SHIELD. It's always seemed odd to me that SHIELD doesn't have one, and Nick winds up doing the work himself (kind of like Kirk always beaming down to the planet on Star Trek: "Huh. New planet, could be dangerous and kill anyone we send down... Better let the Captain go.").

BTW, do you have a name for your SHIELD? If not, might I suggest the Agency for Espionage, Global Intelligence, and Security; or AEGIS?
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Wed Oct 15, 2014 3:26 am

I did remember hearing something about that too, cheers SHF!

I love the fact that (IIRC) Steve Rogers worked as an artist at the in-universe version of Marvel Comics, probably drew his own adventures.

GB- I will be having a James Bond figure, I did debate having a codename that is attached to a role, and passed to each agent that takes it; the way that some people have said that 'James Bond', like 007, is a designated code name.
I also have an idea that a knightly order, dedicated to fighting supernatural evil for hundreds of years, survives and evolves into an MIB-style MI13 group.

The first proper story that I plan on writing involves a covert group being sent to stop a Nazi expedition to Caspak/ Caprona (or possibly into the Earth/ South America/ Skull Island/ one of the other places) to get dinosaurs to use in their armies. Arrow is the one tasked with reaching out to other heroes in order to recruit them. While the patriotic-theme characters are fighting on the front lines, some of the 'street-level' heroes undertake special missions.
The director won't be going on missions unless he can help it.

That's a cool name, thanks Smile
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Thu Oct 16, 2014 3:00 pm

@CptW,

I always thought it strange that for a while, Rogers drew his own adventures at Marvel lol. Very fourth wall IMO.

I did agree with the idea that J. Bond/007 was a code name too, and it almost works, but something threw the idea out for me. Lazenby still has Connery-era gadgets, such as the watch. Moore visits the grave site of Lazenby Bond's wife, Tracy Bond. Dalton's Bond is known by Felix Leiter to have an abrupt marriage. Brosnans's Bond references the death of his wife in The World is Not Enough.

AEGIS is a really good acronym!

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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Fri Oct 17, 2014 3:15 am

In the films, yes, all the actors up to Brosnan are meant to be the same Bond. The people who came up with the original idea obviously weren't actually paying much attention to the films they were talking about! Rolling Eyes

But I did think it would be a good idea, like in the spoof Casino Royale when they rename every agent 'James Bond' to confuse the enemy, or in Burn Notice when a guy tells Michael Westen that he thought that name was used by multiple agents.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Fri Oct 24, 2014 6:21 am

So, my current plans for my 'special ops' (super ops?) WWII team is:

Arrow- archery is nice and silent, he has the intelligence connection.
Daredevil- boomerangs are also silent, and I see him as very acrobatic and therefore stealthy, good for infiltration.
Black Bat- being able to see in the dark should be a major asset, along with guns for when things get noisy.
Ghost- a guy called Ghost should be good at moving around undetected, right?
Amazing Man- martial arts, and turning into green mist should be handy for getting into places.

I kind of see them as a WWII version of:
Hawkeye
Daredevil
Punisher (with a bit of Daredevil)
Moon Knight
Iron Fist
Similar to the Secret Avengers

I thought that the heroic Steel Shark could ferry them around in his sub, maybe taking orders from Don Winslow. I'm trying to pick a PD version of Biggles or similar too, in case they need flying about, but I guess Ghost can just fly them around.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Fri Oct 24, 2014 7:41 am

There are TONS of aviators, Whizz, but I like the idea of Ghost doubling as their pilot if needed. I always thought his plane was wicked cool...
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Sun Oct 26, 2014 12:45 am

I may leave out Amazing Man to start with, and put one of the jungle-themed characters in, that would make sense to guide them through savage terrain. Although, a 6-man team would be good, as I could split them into 2 3-man teams or 3 pairs as needed, and have amusing interplay between them.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Sun Oct 26, 2014 5:13 am

Have you considered Lance Hale? He started out as an explorer, wound up piloting a super space ship with the help of a chemical that increased his strength. Then he had a lost land adventure where he bathed in a magic fire that increased his abilities. Then he donned a leopard skin for a period as a jungle-type hero. With that kind of background, I'd want to recruit him for my government agency strike team!
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Sun Oct 26, 2014 6:25 pm

Funny you should say that, Lance Hale was foremost in my mind, with all the crazy adventures he seems to have had, and the fact that he fought Hitler with Daredevil. Glad to see someone else thinks he's a good candidate Smile

He also adds some straight-up muscle, which I thought the team could use.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Thu Oct 30, 2014 3:30 am

Latest idea I had at work today- someone (possibly Moriaty) acquires the body of Edward Hyde, and in the future my version of Norman Osborn tries to reverse-engineer Dr. Jekyll's original formula in order to create a super-soldier serum for the military.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Thu Oct 30, 2014 4:28 am

captainwhizz wrote:
Latest idea I had at work today- someone (possibly Moriaty) acquires the body of Edward Hyde, and in the future my version of Norman Osborn tries to reverse-engineer Dr. Jekyll's original formula in order to create a super-soldier serum for the military.
I like that, Whizz... Very clever! Of course there are other "super-soldier" serums that could come into your story (maybe conflicting organizations each working on their own version), the idea of the Jekyll/Hyde serum creating a super-powered crazed villain ala the Goblins is genius.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:35 am

I definitely plan to have a few different companies working on different 'bio-weapon' super-soldier stuff, as well as people working on tech.

I'm going to have a hunt around for other examples of potions and things that are from sources other than Golden Age comics, stuff from folklore and mythology. I did even think about including a mention of a village in ancient France that held out against the Roman Empire thanks to its druid's strength potion... Laughing

The Shield's formula, the Black Terror's and so on will all be included too, but I expect that most of the efforts to recreate them will be unsuccessful (at least in mass-production terms).

But my original Marvel-based idea was to have Hulk, Lizard and Green Goblin formulas all be variations worked on at Oscorp. I think that now I don't have to worry about the green link, I will have the Osborn-substitute be based on Hyde, and I may well tie a Hulk-like character into that. Quite a few villiains could come from that, as the company is apparently quite happy to test on human subjects Wink

But I think that I will bin the Lizard in exchange for some form of Werecrocodile or Weregator. Also, my version of Wolverine was going to be the werewolf equivalent of Blade.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Wed Nov 12, 2014 3:14 am

I came up with a potential organisation for my universe:

SHARD - Superhuman Agent Recruitment and Deployment, responsible for finding superhumans with the potential to be Federal agents (for any agency) or members of the armed forces, training them, and assigning them to the relevant body. So it wouldn't be the direct equivalent to SHIELD.

Or alternatively, Superhuman Activities and Response Division.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Wed Nov 12, 2014 10:16 am

I like it whizz. I seems like it's more along the line of Wally Wood's THUNDER Agents, where the top agents have superpowers, but there's a backup group of top spy-like agents to help when needed.

This level of agents might be called (at least unofficially) "S-men," the same way government agents are called "G-men" and Treasury agents are called "T-men."

Would the superpowered SHARD agents wear matching outfits (so it's more of a uniform)?
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Wed Nov 12, 2014 10:22 am

Here's something that just occurred to me. What if there are a SERIES of uniforms, perhaps differentiated by color scheme, so that the super agents are divided up according to their skills/powers just like the Armed Forces: an air division, a water division, an espionage division, a land attack division, a protection/defense division, etc.
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PostSubject: Re: The WIP "Whizz-verse"   Thu Nov 13, 2014 3:33 am

What I had in mind was that SHARD would scout out these people, assess their skills, determine the best role for them, train them up, then they would either leave SHARD and join (for example) a special section of the Army, or they would remain SHARD agents, but would be seconded to wherever they were needed. This might raise interesting quandaries if, for example, the superhero's army orders were at odds with their SHARD orders.

I do like the uniform idea, it was something I was thinking about the other day, but I got sidetracked into this thought- why did all the Golden Age patriotic heroes wear variations of their national flag in their costume? So that they couldn't be executed as spies in WWII, perhaps? So maybe it's part of the Geneva Convention or something that any Super operating in a warzone must clearly display their national affiliation?
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